totally Raw/uncooked turn in @ Troy Pig Out, Troy NY, 7/20,14

[Head Foolz]

deleted....

 

[chambersuac]

Head Foolz stated:
Here is the message that has just been posted:
***************

To my fellow brethren, through this forum I have learned that while becoming sick during my very first competition that I could have placed the judges in a health situation. For that I am sorry and apologize. Ignorance is no excuse, but nowhere in my preparation up to and including the event, is there any mention of personal health relating to pro comp bbq, including but not limited to; Google, You tube, KCBS rules, other sanctioning body websites, this forum, ect… Only identifiable safety, is regarding the food categories, and their FDA recommended food safe levels. Going forward I will help educate others to this topic whenever possible. Again my deepest apologize.

I have compiled a letter and am considering to send it to KCBS as a formal complaint and requesting a full investigation regarding the events of this contest. If there really is not any wrong doing then all those involved do not have reason to worry or be upset of these actions. The entire thread has been copied and is being saved. However, I will not be submitting it as evidence, only for my piece of mind. The thread was mentioned as it is the source of origination and finding, if they so choose they can request it through proper channels of the site.

Plan of action:
I will be commenting to the BOD KCBS an update to the rules; *turn-in for each category can only be that meat.* If not, the received shall not be judged and given a 0. Unlike the DQ process for illegal garnish, marking, no bone in rib, ect… There is no need to include the verbiage cooked.

as (taken from KCBS website); *Traditional Sanctioned Contest*
This is the most popular type of contest KCBS sanctions. A *Traditional Sanctioned Contest _requires_ the teams to _cook_ 4 meats (Chicken, Pork Ribs, Pork Butt, & Brisket).* The cooking source at a Traditional Sanctioned Contest shall be of wood, wood pellets or charcoal. KCBS Rules and regulations apply. Traditional Sanctioned Contests are eligible for the American Royal and the Jack Daniels World Championship. In addition, all teams who participate in a Traditional Sanctioned Contest earn points towards the KCBS Team of the Year awards held each year at our annual banquet.

Rule# 18) The following cleanliness and safety rules will apply:
a. No use of any tobacco products while handling meat.
b. Cleanliness of the cook, assistant cooks, cooking device(s) and the team’s assigned cooking space is required.
c. Shirt and shoes are required to be worn.
d. Sanitizing of work area should be implemented with the use of a bleach/water rinse (one cap/gallon of water). Each contestant will provide a separate container for washing, rinsing and sanitizing of utensils.
e. First aid is not required to be provided by the contest, except at the election of the contest organizer.
f. Prior to cooking, meat must be maintained at 40° F or less.
g. After cooking, all meat: Must be held at 140° F or above OR Cooked meat shall be cooled as follows: Within 2 hours from 140° F to 70° F and Within 4 hours from 70° F to 41° F or less.
h. Meat that is cooked, properly cooled, and later reheated for hot holding and serving shall be reheated so that all parts of the food reach a temperature of at least 165° F for a minimum of 15 seconds.

I believe the intent of all KCBS rules are obvious but maybe there needs to be an interpretation index, just like pro and amateur athletic sports.
********************

I see that this has been deleted. Is it because you have decided not to file a complaint, or because you don't want everyone to know?

Also, your point about personal hygiene not being addressed anywhere...do you really think it needed to be????? REALLY??? Nowhere will you find, "The cooks shall not add poison to turn in boxes" either. Somethings should just be obvious. Did you really need to be told having symptoms of a communicable disease should keep you from cooking???? Really???

 

[BBQchef33]

:shock::doh:

 

[Head Foolz]

Head Foolz stated:
Here is the message that has just been posted:

Ahhh..... there is a conspiracy here. Dan are you certain you do not live in Dallas and reside on the grassy knoll???

Here is the original post with proper formatting and highlighted text which wasn't provide above...... coincidence????

Looking forward to your witty "faux polite" retort

To my fellow brethren, through this forum I have learned that while becoming sick during my very first competition that I could have placed the judges in a health situation. Even though I did not handle any food the assumption of just being there was cause enough. For that I am sorry and apologize. Ignorance is no excuse, but nowhere in my preparation up to and including the event, is there any mention of personal health relating to pro comp bbq, including but not limited to; Google, You tube, KCBS rules, other sanctioning body websites, this forum, ect… Only identifiable safety, is regarding the food categories, and their FDA recommended food safe levels. Going forward I will help educate others to this topic whenever possible. Again my deepest apologize.

Again as ignorance is no excuse, I have compiled a letter and am considering to send it to KCBS as a formal complaint and requesting a full investigation regarding the events of this contest. If there really is not any wrong doing then all those involved do not have reason to worry or be upset of these actions. The entire thread has been copied and is being saved. However, I will not be submitting it as evidence, only for my piece of mind. The thread was mentioned as it is the source of origination and finding, if they so choose they can request it through proper channels of the site.

Plan of action:
I will be commenting to the BOD KCBS an update to the rules; turn-in for each category can only be that meat. If not, the received shall not be judged and given a 0. Unlike the DQ process for illegal garnish, marking, no bone in rib, ect… There is no need to include the verbiage cooked.

as (taken from KCBS website); Traditional Sanctioned Contest
This is the most popular type of contest KCBS sanctions. A Traditional Sanctioned Contest requires the teams to cook 4 meats (Chicken, Pork Ribs, Pork Butt, & Brisket). The cooking source at a Traditional Sanctioned Contest shall be of wood, wood pellets or charcoal. KCBS Rules and regulations apply. Traditional Sanctioned Contests are eligible for the American Royal and the Jack Daniels World Championship. In addition, all teams who participate in a Traditional Sanctioned Contest earn points towards the KCBS Team of the Year awards held each year at our annual banquet.

Rule# 18) The following cleanliness and safety rules will apply:
a. No use of any tobacco products while handling meat.
b. Cleanliness of the cook, assistant cooks, cooking device(s) and the team’s assigned cooking space is required.
c. Shirt and shoes are required to be worn.
d. Sanitizing of work area should be implemented with the use of a bleach/water rinse (one cap/gallon of water). Each contestant will provide a separate container for washing, rinsing and sanitizing of utensils.
e. First aid is not required to be provided by the contest, except at the election of the contest organizer.
f. Prior to cooking, meat must be maintained at 40° F or less.
g. After cooking, all meat: Must be held at 140° F or above OR Cooked meat shall be cooled as follows: Within 2 hours from 140° F to 70° F and Within 4 hours from 70° F to 41° F or less.
h. Meat that is cooked, properly cooled, and later reheated for hot holding and serving shall be reheated so that all parts of the food reach a temperature of at least 165° F for a minimum of 15 seconds.

I believe the intent of all KCBS rules are obvious but maybe there needs to be an interpretation index, just like pro and amateur athletic sports.

 

[Head Foolz]

Head Foolz stated:
Here is the message that has just been posted:
***************

********************

I see that this has been deleted. Is it because you have decided not to file a complaint, or because you don't want everyone to know?

Nope

Also, your point about personal hygiene not being addressed anywhere...do you really think it needed to be????? REALLY??? Nowhere will you find, "The cooks shall not add poison to turn in boxes" either. Somethings should just be obvious. Did you really need to be told having symptoms of a communicable disease should keep you from cooking???? Really??? Yep!

:shocked::shocked::shocked::shocked::shocked:

 

[Jason TQ]

Head Foolz stated:
Here is the message that has just been posted:

Ahhh..... there is a conspiracy here. Dan are you certain you do not live in Dallas and reside on the grassy knoll???

Here is the original post with proper formatting and highlighted text which wasn't provide above...... coincidence????

Sooooooo......because the formatting and highlighting wasn't there it negates the response and/or implies he was trying to hide something? What you highlighted didn't really hit home of important points. Now you are just reaching hard to find things wrong with what others are saying in an attempt to save face or seem like you aren't the one in the wrong here. Good luck with that.

You started with an "apology", but then quickly went into your laughable diatribe of how you are going to be the sole voice of reason to have KCBS do a full investigation of the contest with the pork. Then you wrote a lot more words........you know.......to make it look like you are being all serious.........and stuff .

Here's what happened overall in this thread. You came into a thread to try and make points about the raw pork and look cool and troll a little to cause a fuss because you think it is fun. Then you got badly caught for vomiting and diarrhea while staying at your own event. Then you actually typed an "apology" after the backlash. But your post with the "apology" contained like 5% apology and then 95% "change the subject again away from my mistake back to what was originally wrong though just as bad as what I did".

So that basically negates your "apology" because you really just put it in there for posturing.

If you actually send your "compiled letter" to KCBS commenting on things like "I will be commenting to the BOD KCBS an update to the rules; *turn-in for each category can only be that meat.* If not, the received shall not be judged and given a 0. Unlike the DQ process for illegal garnish, marking, no bone in rib, ect… There is no need to include the verbiage cooked.", then could you also go ahead let them know they should also update some verbiage on things that aren't clear to some folks?? I've outlined all of them below for everyone to read...............

List of Items/Rules for KCBS to Add Because They Aren't Obvious and Things Apparently Need to Be Like Real Obvious for Folks (I'm not good at wording titles. I think this one is a little long)
Rule #1: If you are Vomiting and Diarrhea'ing all over the place don't be at KCBS Competition.......and stuff. Because Vomiting and Diarrhea'ing all over the place can be contagious and get other people sick that are in the same area if for some reason I thought I should stick around.......and junk.
-Note, again I'm not so good at wording stuff so you might want to edit it for me.
Rule #2: Really all I could think of was rule #1........
Rule #3: Ok so I thought of a rule #3, but should technically be rule #2 but since I can't go back and edit that I'm making it rule #3. Rule #3: "Don't spit in your food before turning it in."
-This one might get passed you at your next KCBS event and I thought I should state it so you know.

So if you could also send that along to KCBS to save us all the time I'd appreciate it. Or maybe KCBS should also launch and investigation into your Vomiting and Diarrhea fest to make sure there weren't any unreported incidents of other judges/teams getting ill. I mean we all do also have copies of this entire thread as evidence. I even screen shot'ed it and email to Fedex/Kinkos to Make Hard Copies in Full Color. Sorry for the purple highlighting, I put that in there for dramatic effect and whatnot to let people know I was super serious.

Looking forward to your next faux retort/spin into saving face. I enjoy feeding those in need.

Yours now and always,
:icon_sick


Edit: On an actual serious note (if anyone believes it :becky, you really do have a great bunch of guys/gals here. Just the trolling stuff is annoying.....on any forum. And so overplayed, but makes some folks feel good when they cause an argument. You aren't going to fix anything on this thread. You went hard at proving a point that no one is following. The "wolves" as you put it aren't going to change at this moment. And of course I fully don't expect you to change your stance for one second as the hole is dug to deeply now and you just have to keep digging until you get to the other side of the earth (rarely on any forum/thread do people back down). There you can continue and actual apology simply by contributing positively to the forum on other threads and not trying to cause a fuss when you could simply take a different road.

But I guess that isn't for me to determine. I'm just another idiot here :-D and could be totally wrong..........wait did I say I could be wrong?? Oh I'm wrong most of the time :clap2:.

Hope to see you around.

 

[chambersuac]

He complains of a conspiracy because...why? He got caught when I copied and pasted what he originally posted??? Maybe he finds it a conspiracy that none of us want to put up with his crap - stuff that hasn't added any value to the thread...

BTW, Head Foolz, the formatting and highlighting really did nothing to better your argument. But, just so you know, I didn't have the same highlighting, as they don't show up in the emails that get sent out. I did notice you changed the post a wee little bit when you reposted it. Just so people didn't think I intentionally left anything out.

I also find it sad and a bit frightening that you really needed to be told that you shouldn't prepare food for other people to consume while you were sick. PLEASE, PLEASE tell us you don't work in food service or in the medical field...or really, anywhere with people. Maybe since you've been told now, we don't need to worry - I don't know.

I'm still pulling for you to come around and be a decent guy and a valuable contributor here.

 

[Head Foolz]

Sooooooo......because the formatting and highlighting wasn't there it negates the response and/or implies he was trying to hide something? What you highlighted didn't really hit home of important points. Now you are just reaching hard to find things wrong with what others are saying in an attempt to save face or seem like you aren't the one in the wrong here. Good luck with that.

You started with an "apology", but then quickly went into your laughable diatribe of how you are going to be the sole voice of reason to have KCBS do a full investigation of the contest with the pork. Then you wrote a lot more words........you know.......to make it look like you are being all serious.........and stuff .

Here's what happened overall in this thread. You came into a thread to try and make points about the raw pork and look cool and troll a little to cause a fuss because you think it is fun. Then you got badly caught for vomiting and diarrhea while staying at your own event. Then you actually typed an "apology" after the backlash. But your post with the "apology" contained like 5% apology and then 95% "change the subject again away from my mistake back to what was originally wrong though just as bad as what I did".

So that basically negates your "apology" because you really just put it in there for posturing.
[/COLOR][/COLOR]

Thank you Dr. Frued for your free psychological analysis. But you a wrong as it was/is a genuine apology.

However seeing your extensive professional medical background trumps anything more I can say going forward, I concede.

 

[smoke ninja]

Head foolz i suggest you read the forum. Get to know who it is your argument is with. You will find not only is he beloved but he has more integrity in his big toe than most will ever hope to have. Dan is an inspiration to all brethren.

 

[Porcine Perfection]

Can't we all just get along?

 

[Jason TQ]

Thank you Dr. Frued for your free psychological analysis. But you a wrong as it was/is a genuine apology.

However seeing your extensive professional medical background trumps anything more I can say going forward, I concede.

Did I ever claim to have said medical background? I simply made some points about how Vomiting and Diarrhea are bad in terms of being around food.

I do happen to directly manage the back of the house at a restaurant and fully understand the importance of those symptoms and have sat and talked directly with our health department about its importance. Also I have have dealt with situations that directly involved employees being sick and took actions outlined by said health department. So I very much take it seriously. I'm sure you will find a way that makes that not matter though. I mean heck, I'll admit I'm not an astronaut, geologist, mathematician :thumb: or any other profession that involves me possibly being smart that you could point out that I'm not "said profession" to try and negate my statements.

You seem to have made a similar medical assessment on the pork situation through the reading of this thread. You must have the same "professional medical background" that I possess. Glad we are on the same page then . Through reading and "self diagnosing" it has made you make the decision to possibly send information to KCBS to launch a "full investigation" because you think there was a medical health risk that should be avoided in the future or something of that nature.

With that in mind does that mean that when you go to KCBS about the raw pork incident to help them conduct a "full investigation" you are also going to help them with your contest by giving them the full details of your Vomiting and Diarrhea extravaganza where you stayed at the event to "all whilst still pushing through and finishing despite the flu"?? You had first hand experience. You failed to address that part of my reply............and instead focused on something shiny to see if you could avoid what you didn't want to talk about......you know the Vomiting and Diarrhea :doh:.

But I'm sure you will let KCBS know of that too if you do want them to launch that full investigation about the pork..........:clap2::clap2:.



Sorry, again I know you won't back down, nor do I expect it. I do hope you come out digging on the other side. It would be great to see you around more on other threads talking bbq.

 

[Fat Freddy]

Wow, this thread has just gotten down right nasty:shock:

 

[deguerre]

Well now. This thread has become a perfect example of why I generally try to keep out of the comp forum.

 

[BBQchef33]

ADMIN WARNING:

ok... so now this thread has ceased being productive and has tuned into who can piss deeper into each others cheerios. What started as a simple question from a judge turned into a witch hunt. The crappiest thing about it is the only people that can possibly be hurt by this BS are the winners of the contest, who did absolutely NOTHING WRONG. We are not about that here and it sucks that it was taken down that path.

So instead of locking it down immediately, we have one chance to cease and desist from the wise ass useless comments and flames and put the thread back to intelligent adult discussion.

In other words, if have nothing productive to add, then add nothing.

 

[chambersuac]

Well Poobah, I don't really have anything "productive" to add, but at the risk of hacking you off, I'm gonna add it anyway:

I want to apologize to the OP and the others reading this thread for my participation in the pissing match. It was beneath me and it was beneath the Brethren. I will cease and desist.

Y'all have a great week!

 

[Jason TQ]

Well Poobah, I don't really have anything "productive" to add, but at the risk of hacking you off, I'm gonna add it anyway:

I want to apologize to the OP and the others reading this thread for my participation in the pissing match. It was beneath me and it was beneath the Brethren. I will cease and desist.

Y'all have a great week!

Ditto. Sorry. Trolling is annoying and I didn't help any. I like my Cheerios urine free :grouphug:.

 

[smoke ninja]

Well I am out of milk.

 

[ITBFQ]

*don't want to hack off the poobah!*

 

[Jacked UP BBQ]

Guess who just got an email from the jack, that this is a qualifier??? THIS GUY!

 

[BBQchef33]

matt.. make it CLEAR for everyone.

The Jack confirmed this contest counts as a qualifer. Right?

:eusa_clap