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comment cards

I flipped through my score sheet this weekend for a comment card....but none. CK is one of my stonger things, we thought it was spot on but 2 of the 6 judges didn't with one giving an 855 and another giving a 6 on taste. I've been in this long enough that I just shrug n move on but with the other 4 giving 8s & 9s.......TELL ME want you didn't like!!!!:evil:

Done with my rant.:icon_blush:
 
the pit crew said:
I am a cook and a CBJ, I try to fill out a constructive card when I judge. For instance I will put meat was dry but flavor was good, meat was overcooked and had a mushy consistency, Sauce overpowered the meat, Bland flavor or something that will give the cook a clue to help them. I do not judge based on a flavor profile I do not like, for instance I do not like a lot of chipolte, or mustard, but I do NOT discount something because I do not like it. I HATE white sauce on chicken but I do realize that it can still me moist, tender and the appearance can be nice so I judge based as if all of the chicken had a white sauce would this be the best.
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And those are fantastic comments! They offer a constructive comment, but do not attempt to tell the cook HOW to cook. I know in my case, that was the entire crux of my disgust with the comment I got at Que For The Troops.
 
tmcmaster said:
Or actually TRAINING judges, instead of a CBJ course that is more about writing a check to KCBS than learning anything...
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My CBJ course was pretty good. A lot of effort was put in to not only explaining judging, but cooking many samples (good and bad) to give people some experience. Of course once they leave the class, anything goes apparently :heh:
 
CBQ said:
My CBJ course was pretty good. A lot of effort was put in to not only explaining judging, but cooking many samples (good and bad) to give people some experience. Of course once they leave the class, anything goes apparently :heh:
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Mine (and several others I have spoken to on this subject) was more about garnishes and their legality and learning the oath. There was very little about what is bad or good about the meat. My trainer actually said he used the pull test for brisket, and looked for a smoke ring... I mean, WTF?!?!:doh:
 
One of our friends came back from judging a contest and told us that one of the judges told her that she doesnt write less then a 6 so she doesnt have o fill out a comment card. On the average day that may make a difference but most likely not BUT what about the bad weather contests where it could make all the difference ?
Pimp theres a team in Mi that is called Smokin Aces Crapshoot BBQ and his logo says it all. Every contest is a crapshoot.
 
Coz said:
One of our friends came back from judging a contest and told us that one of the judges told her that she doesnt write less then a 6 so she doesnt have o fill out a comment card. On the average day that may make a difference but most likely not BUT what about the bad weather contests where it could make all the difference ?
Pimp theres a team in Mi that is called Smokin Aces Crapshoot BBQ and his logo says it all. Every contest is a crapshoot.
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Yeah, I cooked next to them in Armada. I saw the trailer and laughed my butt off, because it was spot on!
 
Before you condemn a judge for "telling you how to cook" consider that many judges are cooks, too. The space on the card is small. When I make a comment I make it as clear as possible and suggest a solution when I know it will apply. I don't have room or time to state my credentials. I'm not asking the cook to agree with me. The comment card is a suggestion, not an order, and never intended to imply I'm a better cook. It is submitted in a spirit of sharing thoughts and ideas for the improvement of barbeque in general.

Nothing will ever stop the judge bashing that goes on here. The core problem is "scapgoating" -- targeting everyone for the less than ideal actions of a few. Like judging itself, comment cards will never be perfect, either.
 
Hub said:
Before you condemn a judge for "telling you how to cook" consider that many judges are cooks, too. The space on the card is small. When I make a comment I make it as clear as possible and suggest a solution when I know it will apply. I don't have room or time to state my credentials. I'm not asking the cook to agree with me. The comment card is a suggestion, not an order, and never intended to imply I'm a better cook. It is submitted in a spirit of sharing thoughts and ideas for the improvement of barbeque in general.

Nothing will ever stop the judge bashing that goes on here. The core problem is "scapgoating" -- targeting everyone for the less than ideal actions of a few. Like judging itself, comment cards will never be perfect, either.
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I totally agree! As both a cook and judge, I try to provide comments on EVERYTHING below an 8; however, it is really difficult to properly fill out a comment card in detail with the Table Captain standing over you waiting on you to finish so that they can turn in the score cards (with comment cards) and prepare for the next category. USUALLY there isn't enough time between categories to allow for more than one comment card even if I have more than one 7 (which fortunately is rare). Cooks may not realize, but if your table is the last to get the entry then you don't have but about 10-15 minutes to judge it. I hate to say it, but maybe the turn-in times need to be 45 minutes apart instead of 30.

I also TOTALLY agree that a judge should NOT try to tell a team how to cook, but should just comment on what they judged - appearance, taste, and tenderness/texture!

By the way, my KCBS CBJ class a few years ago (and my wife's CBJ class this year) emphasized how to judge the MEAT, what is good and bad, with little emphasis on garnish and the oath!
 
bbq.tom said:
I totally agree! As both a cook and judge, I try to provide comments on EVERYTHING below an 8; however, it is really difficult to properly fill out a comment card in detail with the Table Captain standing over you waiting on you to finish so that they can turn in the score cards (with comment cards) and prepare for the next category. USUALLY there isn't enough time between categories to allow for more than one comment card even if I have more than one 7 (which fortunately is rare). Cooks may not realize, but if your table is the last to get the entry then you don't have but about 10-15 minutes to judge it. I hate to say it, but maybe the turn-in times need to be 45 minutes apart instead of 30.

I also TOTALLY agree that a judge should NOT try to tell a team how to cook, but should just comment on what they judged - appearance, taste, and tenderness/texture!

By the way, my KCBS CBJ class a few years ago (and my wife's CBJ class this year) emphasized how to judge the MEAT, what is good and bad, with little emphasis on garnish and the oath!
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I know that from my perspective, as a cook and judge, I would NEVER say something to a cook like 'You should inject.' The comments I have had to give were based souly on what I could tell with certainty from the samples. Appearence, taste, Texture. Thats it.
 
In this case, the comment card made no sense. Adjust cooking temp? Up, or down, and why? Inject; why?

Meaning, was it bland? If that's the case, what in the **** does adjusting the cooking temp do? If it was dry, then say it was dry. If it wasn't tender enough and was chewy or tough, just say so. Or, if it was mushy, same thing.

What the **** was he/she saying, other than "I'm a moron".

Basically you had a moron for a judge; sorry.

I
 
Hub said:
Before you condemn a judge for "telling you how to cook" consider that many judges are cooks, too. The space on the card is small. When I make a comment I make it as clear as possible and suggest a solution when I know it will apply. I don't have room or time to state my credentials. I'm not asking the cook to agree with me. The comment card is a suggestion, not an order, and never intended to imply I'm a better cook. It is submitted in a spirit of sharing thoughts and ideas for the improvement of barbeque in general.

Nothing will ever stop the judge bashing that goes on here. The core problem is "scapgoating" -- targeting everyone for the less than ideal actions of a few. Like judging itself, comment cards will never be perfect, either.
Click to expand...

Hub, I'm actually coming to an opinion that most comments on cards could easily be check-box comments. For example, on tenderness, there's really only about 5 things it could be: tough, chewy, gristle, mushy, crunchy.
Same for taste, but probably 8 or 10 things: too salty, too sweet, too hot/spicy, bland, etc.
 
Lake Dogs said:
Hub, I'm actually coming to an opinion that most comments on cards could easily be check-box comments. For example, on tenderness, there's really only about 5 things it could be: tough, chewy, gristle, mushy, crunchy.
Same for taste, but probably 8 or 10 things: too salty, too sweet, too hot/spicy, bland, etc.
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I think that may not be a bad idea... If it's a 'multiple choice' for comments, more judges might be inclined to actually comment, since they may know that there is an issue with the quality of the meat, but may not be able to fully articulate it... This would give them a way to see a list of things, and say, "Yes! That was it!"
 
Sledneck said:
Best one I ever got was on pork





"Pork had tiny bubbles on right side, did not look appealing"

Score 589

Here's the link to my original post on it http://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1012307&postcount=38
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That's kinda the ***** of presentation and appeal, it's REALLY subjective. One person likes nice shiny perfect red balls of chicken, and the next looks at it and doesn't find Christmas ornaments appetizing at all. It's like when Dr BBQ made a penis out of his pork presentation; on that day he got all 9's. Apparently everyone wanted to take a bite of a penis... :eusa_clap I'm of the opinion that he got lucky not to get some 4's... Comments on appearance dont help much, IMHO. Just score it because it's either appetizing to you (the judge), or it isn't, with degrees of is and isn't.
 
We actually got 2 comment cards on our ribs there, and they were very helpful. Now if they would just tell me what they hate about my chicken, id stop changing the wrong things and making it worse, lol..

I am never happy to see the cards, but in this case I had a feeling on my ribs and they confirmed it, so I was glad to have the feedback.

I have to agree though, no idea what that judge was trying to say...
 
So I had a rib earlier this year with an excellent flavor profile (was really, really good). I gave a 9-9-6.

My comment was "Excellent flavor but was undercooked."

Would I have better to comment "too chewy"?
 
tdwalker said:
So I had a rib earlier this year with an excellent flavor profile (was really, really good). I gave a 9-9-6.

My comment was "Excellent flavor but was undercooked."

Would I have better to comment "too chewy"?
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Yes. Too chewy is probably slightly undercooked, but not necessarily. A bad piece of meat will do this too. Too chewy tells them exactly what they need to to know, no more and no less. Actually, saying "undercooked" doesn't say it was too chewy, it could say/imply other things.

The comment card is there to tell them what's wrong, and IMHO I LOVE it and would appreciate it for anything 7 or less (using KCBS scoring), but that's me. However, dont tell me how to correct it. Usually that doesn't tell me what the problem was at all.
 
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