Are you concerned about antibiotics in your meats?

[ClayHill]

I didn't even read what you posted. But (just saying) people that worry about this kinda stuff breed weak children,

Nice........:-D

 

[landarc]

Hmmm, before this spirals out of control, let's remember that there is science and there is politics, here in q-talk, it is about being civil. I think we should be able to talk about meat without getting all about the government/business/anger.

I think we can have a discourse without being divisive.

I agree with you ClayHill, organic is certainly no guarantee or purity, there is no subtstitute for knowing the producer of the meat (I mean farmer or rancher, not the real producer, as the steer or pig will not help me out ). Fortunately for me, because enough folks have voted with their dollar in trade, we can get that information voluntarily from the market in many cases.

 

[caseydog]

i didn't even read what you posted. But (just saying) people that worry about this kinda stuff breed weak children, which will inevitably give us a weak society as a whole. I can't stomach that....i think of those kinda people like i think of the rag heads who blow up our commercial planes.

Anybody who has half a brain knows what i'm talking about. Get the fark out of my country. Because we eat raw ass red meat here. And we don't give a fark what happened to it before we ate it as long as it isn't thrown in our faces. Darwin's theory of evolution bro. Get the fark out and don't come back.

WTF? You didn't read my post? But you post up this chit? Bite me!

Get the fark out of "your" country? Fark you! It's my country, too.

CD

 

[caseydog]

Yes I do, I have NOT ONE OUNCE of faith in the garbage gov't that has moved us towards socialist communistic death of this society!

The gov't is who tells us that tobacco is going to kill everyone. Guess what, they are wrong. Were the tobacco companies at fault, yup but so too were the "regulators" that allowed their money to get in the way of the truth. 2 wrongs don't make a right but the tobacco companies are forced to be up and up and we cannot even get the idiots in the huge marble structures to fess up to our true indebtedness.

YOUR DARN right I trust companies far more than anything the gov wants me to believe, and more than that I believe in the people of this country that have the ability to think for themselves. If enough choose not to eat antibiotic meat, guess what, there is not an issue after a while. They lost money on it and they have to offer something else

WTF, part two?

Tobacco? Where the fark did that come from? Why would you think it has anything to do with this discussion?

Take your farking ideology someplace else. This is a serious discussion.

And, BITE ME!

CD

 

[caseydog]

Hmmm, before this spirals out of control, let's remember that there is science and there is politics, here in q-talk, it is about being civil. I think we should be able to talk about meat without getting all about the government/business/anger.

I think we can have a discourse without being divisive.

I agree with you ClayHill, organic is certainly no guarantee or purity, there is no subtstitute for knowing the producer of the meat (I mean farmer or rancher, not the real producer, as the steer or pig will not help me out ). Fortunately for me, because enough folks have voted with their dollar in trade, we can get that information voluntarily from the market in many cases.

Thank you! :thumb:

CD

 

[ClayHill]

Hmmm, before this spirals out of control, let's remember that there is science and there is politics, here in q-talk, it is about being civil. I think we should be able to talk about meat without getting all about the government/business/anger.

I think we can have a discourse without being divisive.

I agree with you ClayHill, organic is certainly no guarantee or purity, there is no subtstitute for knowing the producer of the meat (I mean farmer or rancher, not the real producer, as the steer or pig will not help me out ). Fortunately for me, because enough folks have voted with their dollar in trade, we can get that information voluntarily from the market in many cases.

I do agree on being civil. It is unfortonate that small producers do not lend themselves to most of us and BBQ (bbq in terms of large, cheap quanities of meat). Its easy for me to say get to know your producer (thats not always the case for everyone)

 

[caseydog]

I do agree on being civil. It is unfortonate that small producers do not lend themselves to most of us and BBQ (bbq in terms of large, cheap quanities of meat). Its easy for me to say get to know your producer (thats not always the case for everyone)

Good point. It is had to know the source of your food, when you live in the burbs, like I do. That's why I would like some new labeling requirements.

I am perfectly able to take care of myself, as long as I have the information I need. That's all I want. Now, some people may think that it will breed weak children, but I personally believe that knowledge is power. The more I know, the more likely I am to make a good decision.

How can a few extra words on a meat label really be a problem?

CD

 

[ClayHill]

Good point. It is had to know the source of your food, when you live in the burbs, like I do. That's why I would like some new labeling requirements.

I am perfectly able to take care of myself, as long as I have the information I need. That's all I want. Now, some people may think that it will breed weak children, but I personally believe that knowledge is power. The more I know, the more likely I am to make a good decision.

How can a few extra words on a meat label really be a problem?

CD

I am all for full disclosure labeling.....I'm not sure what a proper label should look like and what would even be included. Things get kind of hairy when humans and trust are involved.

 

[gtr]

I think feeding kids crap makes them obese and weak - not making informed decisions about what you feed them.

 

[landarc]

How can a few extra words on a meat label really be a problem?

Well, I have heard quite a few discussions on this very subject out here and I give credit to the representatives from the large ag companies who sat in on the seminars and interviews that I heard. The truth is, the labelling is seen as the start of a slippery slope of consumer awareness that many, if not most, of the very large agriculture businesses do not want folks to start down. They much prefer the idea that the information is beyond out understanding. Many of them, in fact, point to the science, which is very complex and state that most folks do not want to know, or really care, what is in their food as long as they know it is not harmful.

To the extent that they may come to understand that this is desired, they then fall back to the old 'you can't imagine the cost increases' argument. In reality, the data exists, as does the information on many levels. But, if the meat companies had to track and maintain animal raising levels, there would be cost increases. That small label would have cost implications to be sure.

 

[NorCal Q Man]

Bacteria do not pick up the genetic code for resistance. resistant bacteria exist, with the genetics in place, it is the wholesale use of antibiotics that reduce the overall population such that resistant bacteria then become the dominant bacteria. This of it this way, there is a field of daisies, 1000 white ones and 6 blue ones. You go out and kill all 1000 of the white ones. In a year, what you end up with is 750 white ones and 250 blue ones. So you kill all the white ones, and a year later, you have 250 white ones and 750 blue ones...repeat, repeat, repeat and 'suddenly' you have all blue ones.

Contamination actually is a secondary process, the micro-organisms are introduced after slaughter, sometimes long after slaughter. But, as long as animals are held for slaughter in feed lots and finishing lots, you must use antibiotics. In California, it is nearly impossible to get clean beef that is not brought to feed or finishing lots, as there are almost no small abattoirs left.

Respectfully, I disagree with these two points. My understanding of these concepts is quite a bit different. While what you described regarding antibiotic resistance may be the case in some cases. These bacteria in fact have not always existed. They have evolved through mutations. Some mutations are the simple rearrangement of DNA sequences, but under extreme stress, a bacterium can in fact incorporate foreign DNA into its genome. Not to mention that there are viruses which insert their DNA or reverse transcribe DNA from RNA and insert it into the bacterium's genetic code.

Secondly, I guarantee that the Salmonella contamination in that article came from those turkeys, not an outside source.

This is a subject that I, for once, know something about.

With all due respect, Landarc

:thumb:

 

[landarc]

So do I, and while there are cases where mutations from external sources can cause resistance, most of the current cases of resistant bacteria have more to do with poor antibiotic management than they do the more exotic causes. I do agree that the salmonella could have, probably did come from the turkeys, but, it is often from other sources, including poor hygiene, poor maintenance of equipment etc...

 

[Oliverbbq]

Lol....wow the things I post when I'm drunk. I'm really sorry CD. I don't think you're a terrorist.

 

[jestridge]

Bring out the foil hat . I think the heat is getting to people.

 

[Sheepman]

Fresh killed meat

I don't think its the antibiotics that is the prob here. In third world countries (that have healthy animals not ethiopia or something) they don't dope up the animals, but what they do however is eat em FRESH.

ya know what salmonela does? IT KILLS THINGS.... If the animals here had salmonella...they would be obviously sick. It gets there AFTER SLAUGHTER. Which brings me back to the fresh thing again, this meat sits around for Lord knows how long, in the previous mentioned countries, normal practice is kill it in the morn for dinner. Salmonella hasn't the time to breed into something like it does in our meat factories here.

The usda is so worried makin sure people don't get sick...they don't even realize what's goin on... Chicken isn't safe to eat if its pink they say.....

Was watchin a Bourdain show he was in asia somewhere, and raved about the fact that he could eat chicken with out the hell being cooked out of it (pink still), because of how FRESH it .....

That is all

(P.S. grass fed sucks....{in AZ})

Posted from my fancy android fone!!

Yup! In Chinatown in NYC the chicken's served pink at the bone. They have a number of poultry markets where the chicken/duck/quail/pheasant are fresh killed.

When I was a kid, I worked in a live poultry market. To this day I don't like S-market yard birds. No flavor.

 

[hokiebrewer]

I prefer to buy my meat from more natural sources, or where I can even talk with the folks doing the raising of the meat. It is nor for everyone. And it means I eat less meat usually, as the cost is high.

x2. Quality over quantity.