does BBQ Critic.com confuse you?

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chromestacks

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I was just looking at all four KCBS catagories on www.BBQcritic.com I do appreciate the people the view the entries and score the box. I can't help but think WTH when looking at a lot of the entries. How the heck is burnt, blotchy, over sauced a 9? Big deal, the cook managed to get 8 thighs in a box! The nicely glazed, lightly sauced, perfectly presented box gets a 6 or 7 at best? When I see six perfectly cooked pieces of meat that looks appetizing, it gets a score of 9. If something is questionable, I usually up score to the cook thinking that the meat was much better 1/2 hour ago. I thought we (completion cooks and judges) were professionals? When I see or taste a 5, the entry gets a 5, maybe even a 4! I really don't care how much money the cook spent, we all spend a ton of money going to contests! Maybe I am a hard a$$ because I got my share of 5's and 6's. I have studied my hobby and worked hard to improve (the score history show that). I am by no means an expert on topic but seeing all these pictures of burn meat, paint brush lines, sauce or spray marks on the box, careless placement of the entry in the box, it just gets my craw! I guess the wiskey is making me grouchy tonight......rant over
 
BBQ Critic really isn't worth a lot just looking at what the numeric scores they give. Where I find the worth is how the judges (whether certified or not) violently rip apart every detail of the boxes and give the brutal honest feedback you can only get when you have all the time in the world to stare at a box while sitting at home watching "The Gilmore Girls". At least that is what is on when I'm on the site.............

Valuable comments are something like "the 4th brisket slice is throws off the symmetry because the left side is 1/16th of an inch lower than the right" or "money muscle looks great, but the 3rd chunked piece down doesn't have an even coating of sauce like the others do". Those finite visuals checks that get missed when boxing because every eye sees it differently helps me to make tighter boxes. That is where I find the value.

Of course some entries do get crazy comments/scores on there that make you wonder how many Smirnoff Ices the person pounded before conjuring up their ideas sitting on the couch. But those you just ignore :becky:.
 
What I find disturbing is after a CBJ makes clear all the unsatisfactory aspects of any given box they then give it a score of 8 or 7. Herein lies todays biggest problem in KCBS - overscoring.
If every judge would use the written verbage that goes with the number score while considering the final tally perhaps a more accurate scores would preveil.
6 - average is not a poor score. Trust me there is plenty of average BBQ at every contest I judge.

Also, by reading the comments you see some judges are just plain incorrect in their understanding of the rules or procedures.
Ed
 
I do not really read a lot of the comments, just browse and see what the majority are giving the presentation.

I think the value in BBQCritic comes mainly from the actual pictures and what YOUR first impression is of them. Chances are if you look at the presentation and think "WOW", others are going to do the same. If you look and think "looks dry" or "way too dark", others are most likely going to do the same.

Take it for what it is worth, dozens and dozens of actual boxes with dozens of different presentations. That is very valuable.

BV
 
BBQ CRITIC said:
8 - Nice color, meat looks moist. However, there are 8 chunks and only 6 slices.............why?
Click to expand...

This is what makes me scratch my head. Has this judge ever sliced a money muscle? I bet $100 he has not successfully sliced one.

If I heard some one say this in person my response would be. "He must of left his money muscle stretcher at home. You look like a guy with experience, go give him a hand."
 
I've always felt that competitors benefit from sitting at a judging table a time or two, both to see what comes across the table (to gauge it against their own techniques) and to taste what works (and see why it works by talking with other judges).

BBQcritic.com allows the competitor who hasn't sat at a judging table to see what others present, and to see/read why that presentation worked or didn't, even if some of the comments seem off base.

Ed, I'm probably one of those who would give someone a 7 or 8 on presentation and then give fairly heavy critiques... I'm trying to suggest what they might/should change to get closer to the 9. That said, to me personally, the overall appetizing appearance isn't measured by the length of the ribs being all the same. That's why my score and my review may not seem to coincide.
 
I've never been there until this thread, so I signed up. Scrolling through a few boxes and it's easy to see the failings in the overall conceit of the site. The first problem is that the quality of the photos varies greatly and that has a direct impact on your perception of the entry. Next, as many of you have said, folks are spending a lot of time on a box when in a real comp we only get a few seconds to look over an entry.

Some of the remarks I'm reading really put me off: The eight pieces one above, too many "too much sauce" comments, lots of size issues on entries where the size is really too close to call.

Overall, though, I'm finding that a lot of critiques on the site could be about how to take better pictures of your boxes as much as they are about how good your box actually looks.
 
ModelMaker said:
It is what it is, poor pics and all.
The benefit of the site is not going to impact the already proficient teams or judges, but will provide the inexperienced with some info and practice as well as a sounding board for comparisons amongst peers.
I think it's worthwhile.
Ed
Click to expand...

Agreed. As long as your expectations are managed.
 
ModelMaker said:
What I find disturbing is after a CBJ makes clear all the unsatisfactory aspects of any given box they then give it a score of 8 or 7. Herein lies todays biggest problem in KCBS - overscoring.
Click to expand...

Come on up to the northeast and cook. No 3 score system here. Our motto should be "We have fours and aren't afraid to use 'em." Statistically we have the lowest scores in the country. There has never been a member of the 700 club in the northeast. Ever.

We will see maybe 2-3 180s given to a competitor over the course of a season. Those contests down south that have 2-3 180s in a single contest we just don't understand. :becky:
 
CBQ said:
Come on up to the northeast and cook. No 3 score system here. Our motto should be "We have fours and aren't afraid to use 'em." Statistically we have the lowest scores in the country. There has never been a member of the 700 club in the northeast. Ever.

We will see maybe 2-3 180s given to a competitor over the course of a season. Those contests down south that have 2-3 180s in a single contest we just don't understand. :becky:
Click to expand...

The BBQ is just better here. :twisted:
 
Hey Chris,

I do cook the north east. I have also judged a few contest in the past. Actually what got me into competition was the amount of bad q I saw come across the table. My thought process was "I can do much better then this". I still don't understand what went wrong when I get a" 7" or 2 in appearance??? The hours of going over photos and saying what the Fark! or when you get 3 top 10 finishes (3rd, 4th and 7th) but do not finish in the top 10??? 3rd place on the table and come in
DAL in that category??? SMH..........moving on to the next contest
 
At the BBQ Critic site I try to spend the same 5 to 8 seconds that judges usually spend on appearance, then I jot down my number and maybe a comment or two on a piece of paper before looking at the scores by others. I do the same with the "rate my box" photos posted here.

The fact is, some Q is harder to photograph than others, and the boxes are not always in the best light... white balance is off... or they are not in complete focus. I do like to see the photos from a judges perspective, not a side shot or top view. Ribs and chicken photo's usually come out fairly close to life-like. Brisket almost always looks drier in a photo than in person. Light will sometimes play tricks in chicken entries. With that in mind my scores when looking at photos often span two numbers 7/8 or whatever.
 
I believe that there is value in BBQ Critic for "new" teams to know what different boxes can look like, as well as what reaction different looks get from the judges on that site.
There is also value for judges to see how their scores would match up with other judge's scores and comments as to why. Like Herb says on the site - if you are two or more points off the average then you might want to rethink your score.

All this being said, there are a few on that site that would rather dig until they find something wrong rather than give it what their first 2-5 second impression tells them it should be. The photographs leave MUCH to be desired in MANY entries! Also, in person I truly believe that the scores would be higher as the entries probably look more moist in person than in the photo.
 
I'm of a different take. I think these rate my box sites are doing more harm than good. There are far more less experienced judges judging than long time judges. These sites post up a bunch of boxes and people throw out a bunch of numbers and comments without any real reasoning as to why this box is an 8 vs a 7 vs a 6 vs a 9. People tend to nitpick the boxes and it creates an impression to newer judges that these are the things they should be looking for. I wonder how many newer judges have spent time on these sites, gone to a contest and instead of judging "how appetizing does the meat look" like they were taught in judge's school they look for all the nitpicky things that they've read and seen on rating sites.
 
I don't even go there any more.

We posted a box a year or so ago that we got all 9's in appearance on just to see what would happen. No surprise they ripped it apart. :doh:

All it does for me is to make me even more confused about what judges think.
As if weekly head scratching doesn't provide me enough of that.
 
Whenever someone asks about a box on here I always give them two opinions.

1. What I would give it at the table with a few seconds to make up my mind
2. What I can see now that I have all the time in the world to look at the picture.

These are typically totally different.
 
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