Charcoal and cancer risk ???

More scare tactics from the gas boys. Simple answer don't eat charcoal.

My response is not fact based, I hope it's common sense based.

I doubt you're planning to embrace a revolutionary " all char-grilled diet" any time soon, so I'm pretty sure grilling with charcoal occasionally is unlikely to be a factor in whether you or other family members develop cancer. A balanced, healthy lifestyle should help avoid that eventuality.

I would suggest that with all the risks from chemical food additives, air and water pollution, GM produce and a depleted ozon layer, you can enjoy a steak at home with friends and family occasionally without having to worry about the PAHs.

Be well, enjoy life.

Everything causes cancer...moderation in everything, including moderation!

I did a google search for "does using charcoal raise cancer risk?" I was amazed to how many articles stated yes including ACS (American Cancer Society) I will admit it was interesting read, all the articles stated the same thing. However; with all that I look forward to lighting up the weber tonight.

kmarsal said:

BBQ Brethren,
I need some sane and informed perspectives.

I used to cook with charcoal and briquettes for many years, but switched to gas for convenience.

As I've aged and come to appreciate that finer things in life come with a bit more care, I'm very much enamored with switching over to Kamado-style grilling.

I have a very health and environmentally conscious wife. When I shared the grilling direction I wanted to pursue, she asked "isn't charcoal-grilling more associated with cancer than gas-grilling" ?

So ... I ask for help to respond in properly informed, factbased, and respectful way (Note - wife holds dual college degrees and a law degree - so no shortcuts possible).

This could be problamatic no matter what info you propose in your defense. No offense to your wife, but I have a MIL with a similar education background that is a retired teacher. You can imagine the cat chasing it's tail arguments I'm sure...

With some google-surfing, I concluded the following:
From About.com Environmental Magazine:
* Charcoal Grilling May Pose Cancer Risks

Key word in Red: Lot's of things MAY cause cancer. Many things can...a lot ofit depends on your body. We all carry cancer cells in our system...It's just a matter of whether they turn into malignant tumors or not. Eating a diet rich in anti-oxidents can counter cancer causing cell.

-> According to the American Cancer Society, PAHs form when fat from meat drips onto the charcoal. They then rise with the smoke and can get deposited on the food. They can also form directly on the food as it is charred. The hotter the temperature and the longer the meat cooks, the more HCAs are formed.
* Avoid Health Risks by Using Natural Charcoal (Kinda helps the debate)
http://environment.about.com/od/health/a/charcoal_grills.htm


From StraightDope.com:
* The risk is mainly when we're talking about grilling over open flame at high heat. Slow barbecue, which generally involves lower temperatures and minimal flame exposure, seems to be less problematic.
* There's nothing inherent in gas or charcoal that makes one grilling method safer than the other (Again, it doesn't make a difference in method according to this statement)
http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2519/does-barbecuing-cause-cancer

From eMagazine:
* Kamado grills such as Big Green Egg are listed as a green grilling option
http://www.emagazine.com/magazine-archive/how-green-is-that...grill


I would appreciate the BBQ Brethrens to equip me with further facts and figures to bring back for making my case.

Thank you,

kmarsal

Click to expand...

The problem I think that you're going to find is that there are arguements on both sides of every issue. Look at any of the major issues like global warming and the such. Both sides of any arguement/issue want to be right, and they'll both provide "scientific evidence" to support their claim. Not sure if any of this helps...just trying to bring reason to what I see an an unreasonable issue that has no real support behind it IMHO.

This question comes up from time to time on this and many other forums. Not many (or any) articles or news stories each year of people dropping dead from "charcoal cancer". I've done my fair share of reading up on this and am not worried one bit. I'm even typing this as I stir 8 packets of sweet n low into my coffee..........ok now 9 just for good measure :becky:.

But in all seriousness charcoal is said to have things in it that "can cause" cancer. There is also (as others have pointed out) many other things that "can cause" cancer if you ingest an impossible amount of whatever the thing is. People that are paranoid about these things are hard to convince otherwise and those people are free to live their lives as they want and not eat or use things that "may" cause cancer. I'm going to fire up my smoker now.......I like to live dangerously :razz:.

Here are some other discussions on the subject in this forum

http://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/showthread.php?t=124026

http://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-103968.html

One has to ask the researches that have dug up prehistoric man. Did they find cancer cells in any of the bone material? Does cancel cells last that long? If so wouldn't you think those that cooked EVERYTHING over open flame would be riddled with cancer?

It's safe. Question has been asked here a million times. Same responses will be given. I would bother to reply, but tired of it really.

If you are so worried about cancer, just give up, because being alive causes cancer, so does breathing air, etc.

BBQ Bacon said:

One has to ask the researches that have dug up prehistoric man. Did they find cancer cells in any of the bone material? Does cancel cells last that long? If so wouldn't you think those that cooked EVERYTHING over open flame would be riddled with cancer?

Click to expand...

I think that another good question that seems to often get over looked is...

Who paid for the research study?

The notion that charred food causes cancer has been around for a long time. We are also told that soaking meat in a marinade before grilling it reduces the risks from eating it.

Personally, I have never put much weight in the study. I think about the saccharin cancer warnings from a few years ago too. However, between the time that saccharin was discovered in 1879 to today not a single case of cancer in a human has been traced to saccharin. That fact alone makes me think that saccharin is probably the safest of all artificial sweeteners. What other artificial sweetener has a 122 year track record?

One other thing to keep in mind is, the saccharin "study" results were published in 1977. That just so happened to be when NutraSweet (aspartame) was trying to get the final FDA approval to begin marketing its artificial sweetener.

Was the study more about selling NutraSweet than real Science? You can decide that for yourself, but I am suspicious. Humans have been eating meat cooked over an open fire for thousands of years and yet I know of no cancer cases directly traced to food because it was grilled or barbecued over a wood fire. That's a pretty good track record too, I think.

Now, who would make up things and/or stretch the truth in an attempt to convince people to stop eating animal flesh? What kind of influence do they have on these kinds of "studies?" I don't know but I am suspicious of that in this case too.

The two primary substances at question produced by charring meat are: Heterocyclic Amines (HCA) and Polycyclic Aromatic Hydrocarbons (PAH).

PAH is on the SUSPECTED carcinogen list, not the known carcenogen list.

There are a lot of people out there who will do any study you want if you pay them enough.

Here is the list of known carcinogens from the International Agency for Research on Cancer. I don't see HCA or PAH in it.

Acetaldehyde (from consuming alcoholic beverages)
Acid mists, strong inorganic
Aflatoxins
Alcoholic beverages
Aluminum production
4-Aminobiphenyl
Areca nut
Aristolochic acid (and plants containing it)
Arsenic and inorganic arsenic compounds
Asbestos (all forms) and mineral substances (such as talc or vermiculite) that contain asbestos
Auramine production
Azathioprine
Benzene
Benzidine and dyes metabolized to benzidine
Benzo[a]pyrene
Beryllium and beryllium compounds
Betel quid, with or without tobacco
Bis(chloromethyl)ether and chloromethyl methyl ether (technical-grade)
Busulfan
1,3-Butadiene
Cadmium and cadmium compounds
Chlorambucil
Chlornaphazine
Chromium (VI) compounds
Clonorchis sinensis (infection with)
Coal, indoor emissions from household combustion
Coal gasification
Coal-tar distillation
Coal-tar pitch
Coke production
Cyclophosphamide
Cyclosporine
Diethylstilbestrol
Epstein-Barr virus (infection with)
Erionite
Estrogen postmenopausal therapy
Estrogen-progestogen postmenopausal therapy (combined)
Estrogen-progestogen oral contraceptives (combined) (Note: There is also convincing evidence in humans that these agents confer a protective effect against cancer in the endometrium and ovary)
Ethanol in alcoholic beverages
Ethylene oxide
Etoposide
Etoposide in combination with cisplatin and bleomycin
Fission products, including strontium-90
Formaldehyde
Haematite mining (underground)
Helicobacter pylori (infection with)
Hepatitis B virus (chronic infection with)
Hepatitis C virus (chronic infection with)
Human immunodeficiency virus type 1
Human papilloma virus (HPV) types 16, 18, 31, 33, 35, 39, 45, 51, 52, 56, 58, 59 (infection with) (Note: The HPV types that have been classified as carcinogenic to humans can differ by an order of magnitude in risk for cervical cancer)
Human T-cell lymphotropic virus type I (HTLV-1) (infection with)
Ionizing radiation (all types)
Iron and steel founding (workplace exposure)
Isopropyl alcohol manufacture using strong acids
Kaposi sarcoma herpesvirus (KSHV)/human herpesvirus 8
Leather dust
Magenta production
Melphalan
Methoxsalen (8-methoxypsoralen) plus ultraviolet A radiation
4,4'-Methylenebis(chloroaniline) (MOCA)
Mineral oils, untreated or mildly treated
MOPP and other combined chemotherapy including alkylating agents
2-Naphthylamine
Neutron radiation
Nickel compounds
N'-Nitrosonornicotine (NNN) and 4-(N-Nitrosomethylamino)-1-(3-pyridyl)-1-butanone (NNK)
Opisthorchis viverrini (liver fluke; infection with)
Painter (workplace exposure as a)
3,4,5,3',4'-Pentachlorobiphenyl (PCB-126)
2,3,4,7,8-Pentachlorodibenzofuran
Phenacetin (and mixtures containing it)
Phosphorus-32, as phosphate
Plutonium
Radioiodines, including iodine-131
Radionuclides, alpha-particle-emitting, internally deposited (Note: Specific radionuclides for which there is sufficient evidence for carcinogenicity to humans are also listed individually as Group 1 agents)
Radionuclides, beta-particle-emitting, internally deposited (Note: Specific radionuclides for which there is sufficient evidence for carcinogenicity to humans are also listed individually as Group 1 agents)
Radium-224 and its decay products
Radium-226 and its decay products
Radium-228 and its decay products
Radon-222 and its decay products
Rubber manufacturing industry
Salted fish (Chinese-style)
Schistosoma haematobium (flatworm; infection with)
Semustine (methyl-CCNU)
Shale oils
Silica dust, crystalline, in the form of quartz or cristobalite
Solar radiation
Soot (as found in workplace exposure of chimney sweeps)
Sulfur mustard
Tamoxifen (Note: There is also conclusive evidence that tamoxifen reduces the risk of contralateral breast cancer in breast cancer patients)
2,3,7,8-Tetrachlorodibenzo-para-dioxin
Thiotepa
Thorium-232 and its decay products
Tobacco, smokeless
Tobacco smoke, secondhand
Tobacco smoking
ortho-Toluidine
Treosulfan
Ultraviolet (UV) radiation, including UVA, UVB, and UVC rays
Ultraviolet-emitting tanning devices
Vinyl chloride
Wood dust
X- and Gamma-radiation


Here is the list of Reasonably anticipated but not known to be human carcinogens.

Acetaldehyde
2-Acetylaminofluorene
Acrylamide
Acrylonitrile
Adriamycin® (doxorubicin hydrochloride)
2-Aminoanthraquinone
o-Aminoazotoluene
1-Amino-2,4-dibromoanthraquinone
1-Amino-2-methylanthraquinone
2-Amino-3,4-dimethylimidazo[4,5-f]quinoline (MeIQ)
2-Amino-3,8-dimethylimidazo[4,5-f]quinoxaline (MeIQx)
2-Amino-3-methylimidazo[4,5-f]quinoline (IQ)
2-Amino-1-methyl-6-phenylimidazo[4,5-b]pyridine (PhIP)
Amitrole
o-Anisidine hydrochloride
Azacitidine (5-Azacytidine®, 5-AzaC)
Benz[a]anthracene
Benzofluoranthene
Benzo fluoranthene
Benzo fluoranthene
Benzopyrene
Benzotrichloride
Bromodichloromethane
2, 2-bis-(bromoethyl)-1,3-propanediol (technical grade)
Butylated hydroxyanisole (BHA)
Captafol
Carbon tetrachloride
Ceramic fibers (respirable size)
Chloramphenicol
Chlorendic acid
Chlorinated paraffins (C12, 60% chlorine)
1-(2-chloroethyl)-3-cyclohexyl-1-nitrosourea
Bis(chloroethyl) nitrosourea
Chloroform
3-Chloro-2-methylpropene
4-Chloro-o-phenylenediamine
Chloroprene
p-Chloro-o-toluidine and p-chloro-o-toluidine hydrochloride
Chlorozotocin
C.I. basic red 9 monohydrochloride
Cisplatin
Cobalt sulfate
Cobalt-tungsten carbide: powders and hard metals
p-Cresidine
Cupferron
Dacarbazine
Danthron (1,8-dihydroxyanthraquinone)
2,4-Diaminoanisole sulfate
2,4-Diaminotoluene
Diazoaminobenzene
Dibenz[a,h]acridine
Dibenz[a,j]acridine
Dibenz[a,h]anthracene
7H-Dibenzo[c,g]carbazole
Dibenzo[a,e]pyrene
Dibenzo[a,h]pyrene
Dibenzo[a,i]pyrene
Dibenzo[a,l]pyrene
1,2-Dibromo-3-chloropropane
1,2-Dibromoethane (ethylene dibromide)
2,3-Dibromo-1-propanol
Tris (2,3-dibromopropyl) phosphate
1,4-Dichlorobenzene
3,3'-Dichlorobenzidine and 3,3'-dichlorobenzidine dihydrochloride
Dichlorodiphenyltrichloroethane (DDT)
1,2-Dichloroethane (ethylene dichloride)
Dichloromethane (methylene chloride)
1,3-Dichloropropene (technical grade)
Diepoxybutane
Diesel exhaust particulates
Diethyl sulfate
Diglycidyl resorcinol ether
3,3'-Dimethoxybenzidine
4-Dimethylaminoazobenzene
3,3'-Dimethylbenzidine
Dimethylcarbamoyl chloride
1,1-Dimethylhydrazine
Dimethyl sulfate
Dimethylvinyl chloride
1,6-Dinitropyrene
1,8-Dinitropyrene
1,4-Dioxane
Disperse blue 1
Dyes metabolized to 3,3'-dimethoxybenzidine
Dyes metabolized to 3,3'-dimethylbenzidine
Epichlorohydrin
Ethylene thiourea
Di(2-ethylhexyl) phthalate
Ethyl methanesulfonate
Furan
Glass wool fibers (inhalable)
Glycidol
Hexachlorobenzene
Hexachlorocyclohexane isomers
Hexachloroethane
Hexamethylphosphoramide
Hydrazine and hydrazine sulfate
Hydrazobenzene
Indeno[1,2,3-cd]pyrene
Iron dextran complex
Isoprene
Kepone® (chlordecone)
Lead and lead compounds
Lindane and other hexachlorocyclohexane isomers
2-Methylaziridine (propylenimine)
5-Methylchrysene
4,4'-Methylenebis(2-chloroaniline)
4-4'-Methylenebis(N,N-dimethyl)benzenamine
4,4'-Methylenedianiline and its dihydrochloride salt
Methyleugenol
Methyl methanesulfonate
N-methyl-N'-nitro-N-nitrosoguanidine
Metronidazole
Michler's ketone [4,4'-(dimethylamino) benzophenone]
Mirex
Naphthalene
Nickel (metallic)
Nitrilotriacetic acid
o-Nitroanisole
Nitrobenzene
6-Nitrochrysene
Nitrofen (2,4-dichlorophenyl-p-nitrophenyl ether)
Nitrogen mustard hydrochloride
Nitromethane
2-Nitropropane
1-Nitropyrene
4-Nitropyrene
N-nitrosodi-n-butylamine
N-nitrosodiethanolamine
N-nitrosodiethylamine
N-nitrosodimethylamine
N-nitrosodi-n-propylamine
N-nitroso-N-ethylurea
4-(N-nitrosomethylamino)-1-(3-pyridyl)-1-butanone
N-nitroso-N-methylurea
N-nitrosomethylvinylamine
N-nitrosomorpholine
N-nitrosonornicotine
N-nitrosopiperidine
N-nitrosopyrrolidine
N-nitrososarcosine
o-Nitrotoluene
Norethisterone
Ochratoxin A
4,4'-Oxydianiline
Oxymetholone
Phenacetin
Phenazopyridine hydrochloride
Phenolphthalein
Phenoxybenzamine hydrochloride
Phenytoin
Polybrominated biphenyls (PBBs)
Polychlorinated biphenyls (PCBs)

Polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons (PAHs)

Procarbazine hydrochloride
Progesterone
1,3-Propane sultone
beta-Propiolactone
Propylene oxide
Propylthiouracil
Reserpine
Riddelliine
Safrole
Selenium sulfide
Streptozotocin
Styrene
Styrene-7,8-oxide
Sulfallate
Tetrachloroethylene (perchloroethylene)
Tetrafluoroethylene
Tetranitromethane
Thioacetamide
4,4'-Thiodianaline
Thiourea
Toluene diisocyanate
o-Toluidine and o-toluidine hydrochloride
Toxaphene
Trichloroethylene
2,4,6-Trichlorophenol
1,2,3-Trichloropropane
Ultraviolet A radiation
Ultraviolet B radiation
Ultraviolet C radiation
Urethane
Vinyl bromide
4-Vinyl-1-cyclohexene diepoxide
Vinyl fluoride

There are some substances higher on the priority list than grilled meats. In fact, PAH's are not known to cause cancer according to the International Agency for Research on Cancer.
http://www.cancer.org/Cancer/CancerC...an-carcinogens

And, you have this - An important proviso to be kept in mind is that cancers in laboratory rats and mice are induced by doses (per unit of body weight) several orders of magnitude higher than what are usually ingested in normal meals by humans. (Typically, the amounts of HCAs are over a million times higher, based on calculations from data furnished in Augustsson [1999].) In fact, by itself, the ingested daily amount of heterocyclic amines is very probably too small to explain the development of human cancers, and the same is true for numerous other carcinogens. Thus, the simultaneous presence of heterocyclic amines with other genotoxic [i.e., inducing DNA damage] carcinogens and with tumor-promoting agents or tumor-promoting conditions makes it very difficult to make a numerical calculation for risk estimation.

http://www.beyondveg.com/tu-j-l/raw-...ooked-1e.shtml


The ingredients in Kingsford charcoal and their purpose:

Wood Char - heat
Mineral Char - also for heat
Mineral Carbon - also for heat
Limestone - for the light-ash color
Starch - to bind the other ingredients
Borax - for easy release from molds
Sodium nitrate - for quicker ignition
Sawdust - for quicker ignition

Now, I have no problem with any of those ingredients except the mineral char and carbon which is coal. The problem with coal is the nasty gases it produces.
There was a lawsuit brought against Clorox Co. (Kingsford is a subsidiary of the Clorox Co.) back in 2008 by the wife of a chef named James Beets who was the master chef for 10 years at a Weber Grill Restaurant where they cooked inside using Kingsford charcoal. He was diagnosed with blood cancer and his doctors traced it back to the benzene gas produced by the Kingsford charcoal used in the restaurant's grills. The lawsuit basically said the company failed to warn consumers that using the benzene-containing briquettes indoors could lead to the development of multiple myeloma.
What I find most interesting is that Kingsford introduced their reformulated charcoal in 2009. Did the lawsuit actually prompt the reformulation? That's a question I would like to have an answer to.

Now, will occasionally using Kingsford outdoors result in inhaling enough benzene to kill a person? I don't know of any cases where that has been proven or even suspected. So, I don't have a problem with using it. Now, if I were using it indoors in a kitchen filled with grills even with ventilation, I might be concerned.


Nitrates are fairly stable nitrogen compounds that can be degraded into nitrites. Nitrites are unstable and can combine readily with other compounds in the digestive tract to form carcinogenic nitrosamines. Please google nitrates and vegetables. You don't need to eat BBQ or cured meats to get a good dose of nitrates. On top of all that, burnt toast contains PAHs too.

Anyway, I'm not a doctor, so do your own research and work through it with your doctor.


More here - http://www.bbq-brethren.com/forum/sh...d.php?t=124026

I am a cancer survivor, and I grill and smoke meats with charcoal, even red meats. I even enjoy a good cigar from time to time.

I don't eat grilled and smoked red meats every meal -- or even every day. I only smoke about a dozen cigars in a year, at the most.

Many cancers, including mine, have nothing to do with food and lifestyle choices. They just happen.

Eat a balanced diet, get regular checkups, and if you notice something unusual, see a doctor about it -- and request a specialist. My family doctor thought my tumor was a farking infection and wanted to prescribe anti-biotics. The specialist knew right away it was a tumor.

Basically, moderation and observation is my rule.

CD

I've mentioned it once, I'll say it again.....

STAY AWAY from Kingsford or any other charcoal that contains "mineral carbon". That's a sweet way to say PETRO-CHEMICALS :evil:

Lump is the way to go folks......!!! :clap:


Still shaking my head over folks that spend BIG BUCKS on quality food and then RUN to buy the cheapest, crappiest, stinkiest junk for fuel :loco:


Wake up folks, you won't go broke using lump, but I believe (yes, I'm from CA, with roots all over the USA) you will get sick tasting food... and now it's better know that petro-chems CAUSE CANCER :icon_blush:

Your choice of cooking method Kamado-style done with a water pan will be low risk by all of the research I have read. You can do pulled pork, Brisket,Ribs,Chicken all low and slow or hot and fast, with a water pan below there is no fat dripping on the coals causing the bad stuff. So nothing to worry about.
I think the studies are driven by marketing people wanting to prove there product is better for you. Overall I say everything in moderation!

mtbchip said:

I've mentioned it once, I'll say it again.....

STAY AWAY from Kingsford or any other charcoal that contains "mineral carbon". That's a sweet way to say PETRO-CHEMICALS :evil:

Lump is the way to go folks......!!! :clap:


Still shaking my head over folks that spend BIG BUCKS on quality food and then RUN to buy the cheapest, crappiest, stinkiest junk for fuel :loco:


Wake up folks, you won't go broke using lump, but I believe (yes, I'm from CA, with roots all over the USA) you will get sick tasting food... and now it's better know that petro-chems CAUSE CANCER :icon_blush:

Click to expand...

I think mineral carbon means coal; anthracite to be more exact (according to this link: http://old.cbbqa.org/wood/Kingsford.html).

Mined coal typically contains trace elements and some of these are toxic.

Google "anthracite trace elements" if you want to learn more.

I better buy a plot soon after all the charcoal grillin' I've done in the last 20 years.

If you look at everything with a "glass half empty" attitude, then everything is bad for ya. Heck....if ya get right down to it, life is a sexually transmitted terminal disease.:shock: