Questions, Brisket's gone wild!

I don't have the answer to your question, but I do have some questions on your process.

What recipe or recipes are you using? I notice you didn't soak out any salt before applying the rub. What was in the brine? What does dry aging do?

HeSmellsLikeSmoke said:

What recipe or recipes are you using? I notice you didn't soak out any salt before applying the rub. What was in the brine? What does dry aging do?

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I think he is starting with a plain ole brisket. Not one that is already corned. So instead of taking salt out, he needs to get some salt in, thus the use of the brine.

The salt is added in the brine to cure it and for texture. Then have to soak it in fresh water to remove the salt that was in the brine so it will be eatible.

To answer the question about how long to let the rub stay on it, I let my first one last week go with the rub on it for 7 days. You can also take it a little longer.

I'm not sure if the brine time was long enough, and I'm not sure why you want to hold it longer than a day or so.

Here is the deal.... beef can be corned with a brine (also called a pickle), or it can be dry cured. I have not seen a double cure (or aging) like you are doing. If you opt for the immersion brine method like you are using, the brine time is based upon the thickness of the meat (so a London broil will corn faster than a rump roast, or a flat will corn faster than a point). Based on the concentration of your brine and your meat thickness, you arrive at proper brine time to corn the beef. If you opt to inject and immerse the beef in a brine, your brine time is cut way back. Commercial producers use the brine/inject method on corned beefs and hams.

For the most part, folks develop various strength solutions for various purposes, (turkeys, corning, making bacon etc.) and once they find one that works you are good to go. There are tables which measure brine strength in degrees, and you use a salometer or brine-o-meter to measure your solution. These are fun to play with, but again once you find something you like you just use that recipe. The floating potato or the floating egg is pretty unreliable because neither one is constant.

As far as the seasoning following corning, I use a similar one to yours and I let the seasoned beef go at least overnight in the fridge. Much longer and my black pepper and coriander gets soggy.

So, back to your question about holding time. Are you following a particular recipe or method? And did the folks at the German market give you any recommendations on how to mix the brine and how long to brine based on thickness?

Hometruckin said:

Yes Thirdeye, and thanks for the reply. He told me that with the product that he gave me, that the brine would not get appreciably stronger no matter how long it was soaked. I thought that did not sound right. But I prefer to error on the cautious side! The end result is intended to be Pastrami. So far it may not be perfect, but it will be better than store bought!

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This is good that he shared some advice. What they gave you was instruction for a lower cure concentration, and since you used the immersion method, (verses the injection/immersion method) the osmosis occurs more naturally, and the finished product is mild. In fact, this is the reason that you did not need a soak-out period after corning. Now, I'm not saying your pastrami will be mild, that is what the additional peppery seasonings are there for... I'm saying that if you made traditional corned beef with your point it would be milder than say... a store bought one (which almost always need soaking).

The reason I questioned the brine time.... is that lower concentration brines work slower. I use some Lite Brine methods on things. Low salt brines seem so contrary to the methods we grew up with, but I'm having good results. Be sure and keep notes of your process in case you want to change up anything.

Hometruckin said:

My Sausage guy also told me "Don't add sugar in the brine" He claimed that the the sugar causes carcinogens which when heated and can lead to cancer. I kinda felt like telling him that if that were the case I should be loaded with tumors by now. I think that that maybe more related to higher temperatures than what we smoke at. IMHO Any thoughts? My whole purpose for making these brines, rubs, and charcuteries myself is to control what GMO's or un-natural chemicals are added by large processors to my diet. FUN is also a major motivator! Thanks again for you knowledgeable input!
Jed

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I have not heard about the sugar/cancer relationship in brines. Sugars are used in brines and cures to knock the edge off the harshness of the salt. When you add sugar to a brine (pickle) it is called a sweet pickle. Actually, Tenderquick has a small amount of sugar in it....

I think temperature, amounts of sugar, or short brine times are a consideration with sugar. Sugar does act as food for bacteria, which can be of a concern... So if you are brining a ham for 3 or 4 weeks, you don't want much sugar in your brine (most claim 3 to 5 percent is the maximum). If you are brining that ham in a 44° fridge, bacteria growth will be sped up. On the other hand, if you are brining some chicken thighs for 5 hours in a fridge colder than 40°, add all the sugar you want. The dry cure base I use for fish is 1 cup salt to 2 cups of sugar, but it only cures for 4 to 12 hours depending on thickness.

I use white cane or beet sugar in my brines, and sometimes honey if I'm going to be injecting and immersing (like for a turkey breast). Dry cured products like hard salami often call for dextrose because it is less sweet and it doesn't break down as fast over time. In addition to honey, I'm also playing with agave nectar in my short time chicken or pork brines.

If you hear more about the cancer issue, pass it on.

You mentioned you started with a deckle/point. Either my eyes are failing me, or that is a flat in the pics.

That looks good from here. There isn't supposed to be a smoke ring. The whole thing is one big smoke ring.

What tasted off to you?